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Grit ‘n’ Grace — The Podcast

Episode #223: How to Live in the Peace of Who You Really Are

 

Note: This is an unedited, machine-generated transcript that is 70-80% accurate.

 

Cheri Gregory 00:00

“Angsty” describes the way most of us live our Christian life.

 

Amy Carroll 00:04

Angst over our sins and mistakes

 

Cheri Gregory 00:07

Distress over the ways we fall short

 

Amy Carroll 00:10

Despair that our trying harder never seems to get us where we want to go spiritually.

 

Cheri Gregory 00:16

But what ifwe don’t have to live that way?

 

Amy Carroll 00:20

Whaaat?

 

Cheri Gregory 00:20

Today, Andrew Farley, author of the perfect view gives us the secret to overcoming inks with peace.

 

Amy Carroll 00:29

This interview is revolutionary and not to be missed.

 

Cheri Gregory 00:34

Well, this is Cheri Gregory.

 

Amy Carroll 00:37

And I’m Amy Carroll

 

Cheri Gregory 00:38

and you’re listening to Grit ‘n’ Grace — The Podcast that equips you to lose who you’re not love who you are, and live your one life.

 

Amy Carroll 00:47

Well. Today we’re talking with Andrew Farley, co author of The Perfect You: God’s Invitation to Live from the Heart. Andrew is quietly helping millions of people discover the beauty of their new identity in Jesus Christ. He serves as lead pastor at church without religion a nondenominational church on the High Plains of West Texas. Andrew is also the author of seven best selling books, including the naked gospel and twisted scripture. Andrew Farley live a nationwide call in radio program airs across North America, every weeknight at 8pm Eastern Time.

 

Cheri Gregory 01:21

Alright friends, if you’ve been listening to Grit ‘n’ Grace for a while, you know how much Amy and I love taking quizzes right?

 

Amy Carroll 01:27

All the quizzes, Disney Princess quizzes what quote most expresses who you are quizzes what lockdown house would you live in quizzes?

 

Cheri Gregory 01:37

All right, well, here’s the thing, Andrew’s book—The Perfect You — starts with a little 6-question quiz.

 

Amy Carroll 01:43

And we can’t resist.

 

Cheri Gregory 01:44

So here’s the questions and they they are kind of a yes or no. So see which ones resonate with you. Number one, I wish my whole heart belonged to God. Number two, I wish I looked more like Jesus on the inside. Number three, I wish I were closer to God. Number four, I wish I didn’t want to sin so much. Number five, I wish I were more dependent on God. And number six, I wish I had more love for God,

 

Amy Carroll 02:15

we’ll Cheri, all of those feel true!

 

Cheri Gregory 02:18

Well, we will share the “answers” to these after the interview. And more than one of those answers may well surprise you!

 

Amy Carroll 02:27

Andrew, I got to tell you that I am incredibly excited about our conversation today. As I prepare for our conversation today, I realized these are some things that God has been speaking to me so I can’t wait to learn from you tell us what led you to write the book titled The perfect you?

 

Andrew Farley 02:47

Well, you know, for a long time, it seemed like as a young believer, you know, I was just frustrated. I was really confused. By 19 years old, I found myself on the floor of my apartment. I was begging God for answers. I was saying God, I’m doing everything they said to do. I’m sharing my faith with everybody that I meet. I’m in church every time the doors are open. I’m reading my Bible four and five hours a day, and I still don’t feel like I’m growing closer to you. Where did I go wrong? What’s wrong with my formula? I’m doing everything they said. And you know, at that point, it really wasn’t a lightning bolt out of heaven. It was more like 10 years of replacing old thoughts with new thoughts. And at the center of this was the idea that we really are okay with God. And I know we use Bible words like righteousness and holiness. And those are fantastic. But a lot of Christians feel dirty and distant. They feel like they’ve got wicked we even say we’ve got wicked hearts. And yet we’re supposed to live holy. So I found that was a total contradiction. I’m wicked, but I’m supposed to live holy, I’m sinful at the core, but I’m supposed to live righteous. It sets everybody up for confusion and failure. So that’s why we wrote this book.

 

Amy Carroll 04:07

Fantastic. You know, that one sentence that you said, What’s wrong with my formula? Sherry and I and our listeners were self confessed reforming perfectionist and we love a good formula, but they can really come back to bite us.

 

Andrew Farley 04:21

Yes, Yes, they can. And so my my formula was me centered. And I didn’t even realize that it was all about me and what I’m doing for God instead of what he’s done for me. And so there’s a lot we unpack in this book, The perfect view, but basically it’s about living from the heart and not living from a system of religiosity or rules but really believing that God cleaned house and moved in and that he changed you at the core and you’ve got to go to place we call it the one foot journey from head to heart, because yeah, your mind is being renewed but you’ve already got A new heart. And you know, the Bible says be transformed by the renewing of your mind. But it also says he took out our heart of stone and gave us a new heart. And Romans six says we became obedient from the heart. So that’s what this book is all about.

 

Cheri Gregory 05:16

So you know, when you’re talking about why you wrote the book, I’m remembering as a child, I grew up in a very legalistic church, and I got lots of gold stars, for memorizing some of those verses about how evil and wicked and untrustworthy My heart was. So you’ve shared a little bit about other things the Bible says about our hearts, what does that look like in our everyday life, then if we start to believe these other messages about what Scripture says about our hearts?

 

Andrew Farley 05:43

Yeah, I mean, obviously, if I believe that I’m a gossip, then I’m going to continually malign people behind their backs and act that way, if I believe that I’m a lustful person, I’m going to then when the thoughts hit me, I’m going to think, well, I’m already dirty, why not throw one more on the pile? Who cares, I’ve got nothing to lose. And you know, if I’m sinful at the core, then these thoughts are a perfect fit for me. I know, I’m not supposed to, you know, when the church people are watching, or whatever I’m not supposed to, because I’m a Christian, but I really want to do these things. I want them that they make me fulfilled. I mean, if that’s what I believe about myself, then imagine 80 years of saying no to you. And then finally, I guess, you get changed at the gates of heaven with a little spiritual squeegee, he finally cleans you up. But that’s not the gospel. I mean, the gospel is a heart surgery. It is that at salvation, you are literally crucified and buried and raised with Christ to newness of life. I know we use the term born again all the time, but you can’t be born again unless you die first. And that’s what Scripture is telling us is that the day you came to Christ and received Him, you actually died that day. And then you were resurrected as a new creation. So you know, if we were to open you up on a spiritual operating table, what would you look like on the inside? If you’re born of God? What do you look like if you’re born of the Spirit, which, by the way, means the Holy Spirit gave birth to you? What do you look like on the inside? And so to believe that you’re compatible with Jesus, that you’re not an obstacle, you’re his instrument, that you’re a perfect fit? With a perfect God? That’s amazing. That’s a miracle. That’s that’s really what salvation is.

 

Cheri Gregory 07:39

That sounds so hopeful.

 

Amy Carroll 07:41

Yeah. Does I had a visceral like, tear up reaction to hear you talking about that. And I’ve been walking with Jesus for over 40 years, but to think about what do I look like on the inside? So let me ask you, does that happen over time? Does it happen instantly?

 

Andrew Farley 07:57

Yeah, it’s already happened. I know that our thinking is changing. And that happens over time. But what we’re talking about has already happened. And quite frankly, it’s a shame that this is not being shouted from the rooftops across all platforms, where Christians get to share the gospel with other Christians. Because if you’re a child of God, then this has already happened at the heart level. You don’t have to wait or hope or beg or plead for something new to come your way. I mean, scripture puts it this way, count yourself dead to sin, count yourself alive to God. Well, why would God tell you to count yourself as something if it wasn’t really true? He’s not telling you to fake it or pretend even when we talk about identity in church circles, it certainly seems like we’re saying now you need to see yourself the way God does. But the implication is that maybe God’s faking himself out, you know, just see yourself the way God does in this pretend fantasy world, where you’re a new creation. And what we’re saying in the perfect view is, what if God’s not faking himself out? What if this is real? What if you’re not just righteous on some ledger in heaven? Where a bookkeeping notebook or something has you written down as righteous? But what if God really meant it that he took out your unrighteous heart gave you a righteous heart? And then he says, You became a slave of righteousness, which is incredible. I mean, basically, he’s saying, You’re addicted, you’re addicted to Jesus, and you’re allergic to sin. And that’s just plain reality. whether you realize it or not, you’re going to prove this you are you’re going to prove your new identity in Christ one way or another. You’re going to prove it by sinning and being miserable, or by trusting Jesus and being fulfilled.

 

Amy Carroll 09:45

That’s fantastic. I love how rated in Scripture, all of that. I mean, scripture is pouring out of you. And so that means that your message is trustworthy and we appreciate that.

 

Cheri Gregory 09:55

So talk to us about the role of the Holy Spirit does he convict us to live the Christ calls us and what role does he have in relation to our hearts?

 

Andrew Farley 10:04

Yeah, so when we do a study of the word convict, I think a lot of us would really be surprised that in the Scripture, the word convict is used for the unbeliever. And when you think about it, that makes sense. You know, when he the spirit of truth comes, Cain will convict the world of sin, righteousness and judgment, he will convict the world of sin, because they do not believe in me, Jesus said, so you know, that word, convict. Let’s just think about how we use it. I mean, we use it in our society for a criminal that, you know, they’ve gone to trial they’ve been convicted next to, they’re going to be sentenced, and next, they’re going to be punished. So it’s not surprising in the end, that the scripture doesn’t say the Holy Spirit is convicting us. I think what we do read is that he’s convincing us he’s bearing witness with our spirit that we are children of God. He’s our counselor, he’s our comforter, he’s our guide into all truth. We’re being disciplined by our Father through the Spirit. So some people might say, well, that’s just semantics. Well, you know, I think it’s really the difference between discipline and punishment. You know, discipline is training for the future, not punishment for the past. And I think if we could wrap our minds around that, then we go, okay, have I ever had a life coach that said, he would train me for the future, but keep no record of my wrongs, that he would hold nothing against me that there would be no account of my wrongdoing, that he would never drum up my past, but he would prepare me for the future. I mean, that’s exactly what we’re talking about. So God cares about behavior, attitudes and actions. It’s just that he’s training us in a way that we have never experienced before. Because no human can imitate this.

 

Amy Carroll 12:00

You had some powerful sentences in there that you can see visually that but landed with a Sherry And I’m sure our listeners too. So this next question, I’m asking it with fear and trembling Android. Are our hearts reliable as Christians? And if they are, how can we better follow what our hearts tell us while also looking to what Scripture says?

 

Andrew Farley 12:23

Yeah, so the last thing you should do is just follow some sort of nebulous idea of what Jesus is doing. Then Five minutes later, somebody says, Well, Jesus told me to leave my wife or Jesus told me to kill somebody, or Jesus told me to whatever. And so we could go off into lala land following a motion or following the enemy’s attacks or following delusion and error. So you know, fortunately, we’re not left in the dark here. We’ve got God’s word and he tells us what the fruit of the Spirit is. And I think that’s Central. I mean, clearly self control, and love and peace and patience. I mean, these sort of attributes, that’s what Jesus is up to. So if we’re ever wondering what Jesus his agenda is in us, we don’t have to wonder very long, we can simply look to his word, but secondly, I would just say, you know, you asked, Is the heart trustworthy, reliable? And you know, the Scripture is saying, Yes, not every thought we get is reliable. Not every emotion we feel is reliable, but our spiritual hearts really are. I mean, you know, we say this, you know, at eight years old, I invited Christ into my heart, I invited Jesus to live in my heart, we share our testimonies, we talk about our heart, and then an hour later, we’re in church and somebody says, You’ve got a deceitful heart, a wicked heart, and we say, Amen. And we even Amen, that and we really need to be doing a doubletake going, what, wait a minute, I have Jesus in my heart. Does Jesus live in a sinful heart? Wait a minute, Jesus gave me a new heart. Is it wicked? Why would Why do we not even see the contradiction? So I think what we’re ultimately talking about here is we need a whole new grid for our thought life and recognize, look, I’ve got influencers, there’s the world and the flash and the power of sin and my next door neighbor, and there’s all these influencers on us, but that doesn’t change who we are at a heart level. So you know, as little children, we said, cross your heart and hope to die. And then we said, stick a needle in your eye. We’ll skip that last part. But seriously, God crossed our heart. He took our heart to the cross, and we hoped to die. And that’s exactly what happened. We died with Christ. Galatians 220 crucified with Jesus. And now it’s time for us to say, you know, I’m gonna count myself alive and connected and bonded and fused to Jesus. I I’m compatible with him. And that’s good news.

 

Cheri Gregory 15:03

Alright, so with all of that in mind, do Christians have the same desire to sin as they did before they knew Christ? What changes when we accept Christ? And why do we still sin?

 

Andrew Farley 15:14

Yeah, so we have to get to this crazy place. It’s a beautiful, crazy, wonderful, true, but shocking place of saying, I don’t really want to sin. I don’t know how to put it in more plain English, because you know, the Bible says you’re dead to sin. Earlier, we said, we’re allergic to sin. But ultimately, we have to get to the place where we’re saying, I don’t really want to sin, because otherwise God is asking you to not be yourself, please don’t be yourself for 80 years. And then eventually, I’ll take away your true desires, which are so dirty and sinful. Well, that’s again, that’s not the gospel, the gospel is you’re a child of light, therefore walk as a child of light, you’re dead to sin, therefore, count yourself dead, therefore Don’t let sin reign. Like it all makes sense. If I start believing, I don’t want to sin. But where did the thoughts come from? So you know, every four to eight years, we get a new president. And when a new person moves into the White House, there are policies of the former administration that they slowly start to do away with, replace or revise whatever they want to do. And so to me, what it seems like is, we’re the new self, we’ve just moved in to this whole new life. And yet there are policies of the former administration. And that’s what the flesh is. And so we’ve got this network of fleshly ideas that over time, are being replaced with better ideas, God’s ideas for how to respond, how to think how to act, how to choose. And so when we get a thought like that, it’s from the memory bank of the flesh. Now, you’re not the flesh. I mean, the flesh is not going to heaven, but you’re going to heaven. So we need to see that it’s kind of like, you know, I’ve got my my iPhone here. And this iPhone, I bought it about six months ago. And when I did, you know, it was an exciting day, it was the new version. And I was really happy to have it and opened it up. And within five minutes, it said, I needed a software update. And I’m like, what, I just bought the thing. But that shows you the difference between partywear and software. And that’s what we’re talking about. There’s a difference between hardware, spiritual hardware and software updates. So when we say Where did the thoughts come from? Well, again, there’s externals, there’s the world, the flash the devil. But when we get into flash, specifically, we need to see like that’s like, out of date software running in my head. And I’ve got new spiritual hardware, that’s telling me, hey, let’s get some updates from the God of the universe. And I mean, I like to say the good news is, those updates are not really downloads from heaven, they’re uploads from your heart, because they’re not long distance, you’re not making long distance phone calls, hoping that God will swoop down, show up and finally give you a new idea. Now, in every moment, you’ve got uploads from your heart, where Christ lives, and he’s your counselor in every single second

 

Cheri Gregory 18:29

great analogy.

 

Amy Carroll 18:30

Ah, that makes it so clear, so clear. And it’s it’s the picture of what it is to be in Christ, right, that he’s not outside. He’s inside us. So what does it mean for God’s love to be poured into our hearts? And how does that change the view of our hearts?

 

Andrew Farley 18:47

Yeah, so we have loving hearts. And I think that it’s very interesting for us to say, we should forgive, but it’s different for us to say we are forgiven, we are forgiven by God. But it’s another thought to say we are forgiving people by nature. It’s one thing to say we’re loved by God, but it’s another to say we are loving because God made us that way now, so we’re starting to then use adjectives that once only describe Jesus. And now we’re seeing that he has shared himself with us. And he’s transformed us at the core because we’re born of him born of God, partakers of his divine nature. And so that tells us that we’ve got new descriptors of our heart. So when I approached my spouse, when I relate with my family, when I’m relating with people at church or at my work, or at school, or whatever, do I believe that I’m a sinful person, like is that the core descriptor of me? Am I characterized as a sinful person? Or am I characterized as the righteousness of God and someone Who is loving and forgiving? Like, you’re not going to be able to go against what you believe about yourself for decades. So who do you believe you are? What do you think you’re like, who’s in there? Who are you in there? You know, I think the ultimate answer is that God is proud of you. He likes you. He doesn’t just love you in some john 316, generic way, but he likes you, and he likes who you are. And he even likes your uniqueness. And he certainly likes your heart. And so you know, when the worship leader is on stage, and the smoke is rolling out, and everybody’s looking up to heaven, the worship leader says, God, we’ve got wicked, wicked hearts, Lord, and the crowd shouts out in agreement we need to be, we need to be hitting that pause button in our own hearts and going, wait a minute, don’t let your mind think that don’t by that lie, you’ve been changed. Born Again means different, you really are new at the root of your being. And so you know, this is it’s a simple thought. But it needs to be shared in 100 ways for it to really stick. And when it does, man, you see yourself with Jesus and a whole new way.

 

Cheri Gregory 21:19

Okay, so I’m going to go off the questions for just a moment because I can just feel myself because of my upbringing, I can feel myself resisting. And there are voices in my head saying, but if I claim that I am forgiving if I claim myself to be loving, if I claim that I’m righteous than I am guilty of pride, how can I do all these things you’re describing? Because I want to lean towards what you’re saying so much. And then the specter of pride arises. So what’s going to prevent that from happening?

 

Andrew Farley 21:48

Yeah, I would say first of all, I mean, how did you get this way? And the answer is, Jesus did it. It’s not like you progressively earned your way toward a status. It’s not like you progressively cleaned yourself up to get to this point. So this is the result of the cross and the resurrection. So we are proud, we’re proud of Jesus, we’re proud of the cross. We’re proud of the resurrection. We’re bragging on the finished work of Christ. And I think that’s a really healthy place to be. And so then I guess I would just ask the opposite question. Is it humble to say you’re a dirty rotten worm, when Christ has told you differently? What is true humility? What if true humility is saying the same thing that God says? No more? And also no less? Isn’t that true humility to agree with God?

 

Amy Carroll 22:47

mercy? That was a great download, right? He’s so much. So good. Great question, Sherry. Amazing follow up. So okay, all of this change in the way that we’re thinking, what I’ve been processing is how it changes how we react in this extremely divided culture that we are in because I had realized that I had started really being self protective and closing my heart down in this divided culture more than I ever have before. And God has been calling me be open hearted, be open hearted. And this makes sense than why I should be open hearted. Why makes a difference that I’m open hearted. So tell us like, how is all of this knowledge? How does it change how we deal with our neighbors and our friends and our children? our spouses, our church, fellow church members, our social media contacts? Hello?

 

Andrew Farley 23:47

Yeah, yeah. So I would say this, that you do love them, the people you disagree with you love them. You may not have all these rosy thoughts about them, but you love them. And that’s what we will always come back to. So you know, think of the person that you most disagree with politically. Now, imagine they come to you and they say, I’m hurting. I don’t know anything about spiritual life. I’m looking for answers. I know you’re a believer, please help me. I mean, what would you do at that point? I mean, your heart just warms to them and you want to help them because this is bigger than the United States of America. It’s bigger than Republican or Democrat. It’s bigger than Coronavirus. It’s bigger than pandemics. It’s bigger than world politics. It’s bigger than anything. I mean, this is it. There is no greater message and this is the message that’s implanted in your heart and you love them. And so when the New Testament says these are his commands to believe in Jesus and love others, even as he is loved you What’s written on your heart? Some people I know what some people think they say the law, the law is written on your heart. Well, if that were true, you would have 613 Jewish laws written on your heart. Nope. No shellfish written on your heart. No pork written on your heart. No Saturday. Yeah, no way. No Saturday yard work written on your heart. All the men are saying, Oh, I like that one. But yeah, I mean, here’s the thing is that we’ve got these new covenant laws written on our hearts, believe and love others, even as Jesus has loved us. That’s what’s in there. And that’s what you have written on your heart. So look, we’re all wrestling with the nightly news and the 24 Seven News, which always seems to be bashing somebody, or there’s just anger and there’s even rage and there’s constant conflict. And you know, our computers, we the brain was never I don’t believe ever meant to handle all that. I mean, for 1000s of years, there was no 24 hour news. So we’re, we’re bearing more than we have ever been designed to bear. And yet, no matter what flows through our brains, no matter what thoughts hit our gray matter, you really do have that loving go to place your new heart. And so I think you do love your neighbor God has rigged it is rigged it so that you love your neighbor from the heart. And that’s what we just need to come back to every single time.

 

Cheri Gregory 26:32

All right, Andrew, what closing words do you have for our friends who are listening who want to make this one foot journey as you describe it from the head to the heart?

 

Andrew Farley 26:41

Yeah, so we’re not talking about you needing to go somewhere new, or get something new. You know, there are so many so called Christian messages out there about you need to get to a higher plane, you need a second blessing, you need something greater, you need something different. You need more of the Spirit, you need this spiritual gift, you need more of Jesus, we’re saying the opposite. We’re saying that you have been blessed with every spiritual blessing, and that you have everything you need for life and godliness. So this one foot journey, it happens over and over and over. And it’s just from here to here. Every single time when you react to someone, when you reply to somebody, when you respond to some situation, it’s simply wait a minute, I don’t need anything new. It’s all down here. I don’t need to go get more of Jesus. He’s equipped me I’m fully equipped at a heart level. So would you be willing to believe that you’re complete? I mean, let’s let’s just think about the sales pitch in the garden. There they were Adam and Eve. They were perfect. And and they were innocent, and everything was fine. They had a world around them that God had created Satan’s sales pitch was you need to be more godly. Wait a minute, what he didn’t say that? Yes, he did. He said that. He said in the day you eat of this, you will be like God, and so he was saying you’re not complete and you’re not right. And you need to be more godly. And so they didn’t eat from the evil tree. It wasn’t called the evil tree. They were seeking to know good from evil so that they can measure themselves and try to get better and be more godly. That was the the sales pitch that suckered them in. And if we’re not careful, we as Christians, today, we can be suckered by the same sales pitch. So what if we decided I really am complete, I lacked nothing. I have everything I need in Jesus and He lives in me. I don’t need to be a sucker for that sales pitch of lifeless religion. When the enemy comes knocking at the door of my mind. I don’t even have to open the door. I’m okay, I’m right. I’m whole. I’m bonded. I’m fused. I’m one spirit with the Lord. Man, that’s as good as it gets.

 

Cheri Gregory 29:06

All right, friends. Remember those six quiz questions. I’ll share them again, just to bring them back to mind. Number one, I wish my whole heart belonged to God. Number two, I wish I looked more like Jesus on the inside. Number three, I wish I were closer to God. Number four, I wish I didn’t want to sin so much. Number five, I wish I were more dependent on God. And number six, I wish I had more love for God.

 

Amy Carroll 29:33

Now after listening to Andrew talk. I’m a little less nervous about this, but I’m still a little nervous. I’m not sure I want to know the answer to this quiz.

 

Cheri Gregory 29:43

Well, here’s the thing. The answers are actually such good news. And all of this comes from just the first couple of pages of the book. It really sets up the whole point of the book. So first, number one, your whole heart belongs to him. Number two, you are as clean and righteous and as holy as Jesus on the inside. Number three, you are as close to God as Jesus is right now and forever. Number four, you don’t really want to sin. And there’s a shocking reason you still do. Number five, you are naturally dependent on God. And it’s actually your new default setting. And number six, you have an undying love for God. You don’t need more love for him.

 

Amy Carroll 30:30

Those are amazing statements, aren’t they? And they just bring such peace and freedom.

 

Cheri Gregory 30:37

Well, friends, We sure hope you’ve enjoyed listening to Episode 223 of Grit ‘n’ Grace — The Podcast as much as we’ve enjoyed making it for you.

 

Amy Carroll 30:46

And we want to say a big thank you to Andrew Farley, co author of The Perfect You: God’s Invitation to Live from the Heart and his publisher Salem Books for making this episode possible. Check out our web page at grit and grace the podcast . com slash Episode 223. There you’ll find this week’s transcript a link to order the perfect Jew, God’s invitation to live from the heart and a link to Andrews website which has some great resources related to his book.

 

Cheri Gregory 31:16

If you’re not yet a member of our Facebook group, we would love to have you join us. Just go to Facebook and search for grit N grace the community, and you’ll find us

 

Amy Carroll 31:26

next week we’ll be discussing what we learned from Andrew Farley, co author of The Perfect You: God’s Invitation to Live from the Heart and how it’s impacting our lives

 

Cheri Gregory 31:35

For today, grow your grit.

 

Amy Carroll 31:38

Embrace God’s grace.

 

Cheri Gregory 31:39

And as God reveals the next step to live your one life well

 

Amy Carroll 31:43

we’ll be cheering you on. So take it!