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Grit ‘n’ Grace: Good Girls Breaking Bad Rules

Episode #110: How-To for Worker Bees – Weeding Out the Good from the Bad

 

Amy

So, Cheri was there any early evidence in your life that you are made like Martha?

 

Cheri

Well, rumor has it that when I went to preschool I refused to nap. Like, all the other kids loved, after lunch, laying out their little blankets and getting their stuffed animal and curling up for two hours, and I threw a little fit evidently, ‘cause it was a waste of time. And it was so bad that my mom actually, stop laughing at me, my mom actually got special permission for me to go in another room and sit and read. In other words, look at picture books rather than have to go through the torture of lying down and napping. All these three-year-olds were sleeping. They were slackers. What’s that about?

 

Amy

Three-year-old slackers. Yea, I would say, maybe you are a little made like Martha, Cheri.

 

Cheri

How about you, any evidence about you when you were younger?

 

Amy

Well, hmm. Yes. So, you know that I love my home, and I am a nester, you know. I love fluffing and feathering, and this was true, I was very busy at this, even as a child, that I had two closets in my room. I think I actually had the master bedroom in our house. I had two closets. In one of my closets, my mother let me, kind of, make my own apartment in my closet.

 

<Laughter>

 

Cheri

So, you had, like, the executive suite.

 

Amy

Exactly. And, it was decorated and it was fluffed and feathered even as probably a seven-year-old. So, there you go, I might be made like Martha, too

 

Cheri

Well, this is Cheri Gregory.

 

Amy

And I’m Amy Carroll.

 

Cheri

And you’re listening to Grit ‘n’ Grace: Good Girls Breaking Bad Rules. The podcast that equips you to lose who you’re not, love who you are, and live your one life well.

 

Amy

Today we’re processing what we learned from our interview with Katie Reid, author of Made Like Martha.

 

Cheri

The first thing that Katie said in terms of defining what it meant to be a modern-day Martha, and I was so hoping she would say something that I went, “Oh no, I don’t identify with that at all. I must not be a modern-day Martha.” But no, she had to go say we love a good checklist. And I’m like, I’m sunk.

 

Amy

Oh my gosh, this is like one of the themes of my life. I always tell people that I’m one of these sick people who writes down things I have already accomplished on my checklist just for the joy of checking it off.

 

Cheri

I don’t understand why that’s sick. That’s normal, isn’t it?

 

<Laughter>

 

Amy

I was, like, when you did that big pause, I thought what just happened? Did we lose Cheri? Hello, hello, are you there? Cheri?

 

Cheri

I don’t understand. Of course, you do that, because, yes, it’s all about the check mark, right?

 

Amy

It is all about the check mark.

 

Cheri

Okay, so there’s good things to checklists but sometimes they can kind of like go off the rails. We can take a good thing too far. How does that happen in your life?

 

Amy

Well, I always overestimate what I can get done and underestimate the time it will take. So, my checklists are a wee bit out of control usually. I can’t get them accomplished in the time, I think. That’s a con for me. How about you?

 

Cheri

You and I are twins in that. I knew that I had a problem with checklists when Anne Marie was thirteen, and she showed me the checklist she had made for the day. It was like, I don’t know, it was a weekend, and it was eight pages long. Now, it was in large font, but she was thirteen, and she had taped them all together so it unfurled like a scroll.

 

Amy

All the way across the room. Oh, my gosh.

 

Cheri

Yeah, and I was like, oh my goodness, where did she learn that? Hum. I wonder where?

 

Amy

That is hilarious.

 

Cheri

You know, modern day Martha’s, we’re the girls who just love to get things done. But it means we also struggle with uncertainty. We struggle with that C word, Amy. The C word shows up again.

 

Amy

Not that word.

 

Cheri

Yes.

 

Amy

Does our audience know what it is?

 

Cheri

Control.

 

Amy

Control.

 

Cheri

So, Katie talked about moving from what-if our fears and worries and anxiety over what-if, to learning to trust God even-if. So, what is a what-if struggle that you’ve made some progress in?

 

Amy

Well, my big what-if is always what if I can’t contribute, and I put this in quotation marks, my fair share? And this is, my fair share, I have a very high level of expectation for that. And, it goes for writing. I mean you and I are writing right now, and I’m like what-if I can’t do my fair share and really carry my load to the finances in my family. You know, there’s nothing like sitting with a banker and having him ask questions about your finances to feel like you are a total failure because you’ve been a stay-at-home mom a lot of your career, and then to even, serving in my friendships. This is an area of fear for me that I won’t do enough for my friends. That they’re always it feels like they are doing more for me. So, I’ve been working on this. What I’m learning is that even-if, or actually, even when I can’t contribute my fair share, the people who love me they extend grace to me, and they have a heart to serve me, too, and I need to let them. So, what’s your what-if or even if?

 

Cheri

Well, just even listening to you that whole phrase my fair share, I can just feel it in the pit of my stomach. I can feel that weight on my chest. That, you know, I really invite our listeners to kind of spend some time unpacking that for themselves. That might be a great topic to discuss in the Facebook group after the episode. Because, where do we get this idea of my fair share? And I’m sure we each have something different that we feel like we are failing at whether like you said finances or bringing enough to a friendship that sort of thing. I think that’s a loaded phrase. I think that’s something we need to unpack over future episodes.

 

For me the what-if is, you know, I’m going to go back to our origin story – the origin story of Grit ‘n’ Grace.

 

Amy

Yes. Yes.

 

Cheri

And my big what-if since my lifelong dream has been to write books, and you know, God gave me the privilege of writing a couple with Kathi Lipp. But then when I got the rejection a few of years ago on what I thought was my best potential proposal, I was faced with the what-if I never get to write a book again. What if this thing I’ve been dreaming of, longing for, never ever gets to happen. And that still is such a pivotal day for me when I realized, okay, it may not be a book, but even if, even if it’s not a book, even if I never get to write a traditionally published book ever again in my life, I’m still going to share this message, because there’s still women who need to hear it. Now, I’m not saying I’m great at that on every single day. But I look back at that, you know, you and I talk so much about our failures. I put this question in for today, because I thought let’s talk about a few successes.

 

Amy

That’s refreshing!

 

Cheri

Let’s talk about where we do see God moving in our lives? It’s so nice. It doesn’t have to be all the time or huge, but it is nice to be able to look back and go, wow, that was a change, that was a pivot point, that’s where God made a real transformation from the what-if to the even-if.

 

Amy

And the beauty of that is Grit ‘n’ Grace was born in that moment that you said I am going to share this message no matter what.

 

Cheri

Yes. Yes. And we have reached women we would have never reached any other way. And it’s been an amazing, amazing ride. Now, you said you have an example.

 

Amy

I got such a beautiful lesson in this, just this past week. So, I failed to meet a deadline for the second month in a row, which is unlike me I will say, because I’m pretty conscientious about deadlines and my responsibilities. But I failed to meet a deadline for my devotion for Proverbs 31 again this month. If I don’t put it on the calendar, and I didn’t, it doesn’t happen, and I was scrambling and realizing I needed to provide something. And so, I had this back and forth with our editor, Steph, who is just the most lovely. And she was like, “Hey, we’ve got you covered. It’s all good.” So, then I followed that up with, here’s what I wrote in my email, “I am putting writing dates on my calendar right now so that I don’t let the ball drop again. So sorry I’ve been unreliable in the past couple of months.” And the truth is, “Hey I was unreliable in the past couple of months.” But here’s how Steph answered me. She said, “Awe. You’re too cute. In my humble opinion you’ve got like 700 points in the devotion deposit. This is like maybe minus three points. 99.6 percent ain’t exactly unreliable. You’re all good.”

 

How much grace is there in that? I realized, wow, I’m so hard on myself. What if I don’t write a devotion this month? They are going to ditch me. They are going to let me go. They are going to tell me fine we don’t need you anymore.

 

Cheri

Stamped unreliable.

 

Amy

Exactly. Labeled for life. And instead, Steph just extended grace to me, but also reminded me that I have built a reputation of being reliable and missing a couple times doesn’t erase all of that. I was just, wow, my soul needed that. So.

 

Cheri

I bet that’s something that a lot of us who are made like Martha struggle with. We forget our track record of being reliable or dependable or whatever it is. And the one failure, quote unquote failure, ends up coloring everything unnecessarily, and that’s where we can be so hard on ourselves.

 

Amy

Exactly.

 

Cheri

And, when we are that hard on ourselves then it may translate into less grace for others, too.

 

This leads beautifully into the next thing Katie talked about which was this idea of a receptivity deficiency. I was ready to skip this whole thing, but she said, “We might have a hard time receiving, and the line I loved that she said was, “Grace is a gift to be received, not a prize to be earned.” So, continuing the story that you just told, you had another great insight on this.

 

Amy

Well, one of the things I’ve realized in the past, and I realized I did it again in this situation, is that I’ll use a harsh word to label myself like “unreliable,” because I’m pretty sure they are already thinking it so if I just throw that out before they say it to me. Maybe I think it will hurt a little less or it gives them a pass to say, yes, you are unreliable. But it’s just kinda is this proof that I still default to this idea of not being able to receive grace.

 

Cheri

So basically, you are going to bash yourself before they get a chance to do it. You’re going to criticize yourself first. Yea, I recognize that.

 

Amy

Do you have trouble receiving like I do?

 

Cheri

No. None at all. I’m just. I’m, I’m, I’m absolutely…

 

Amy

I only asked that ‘cause I already knew the answer.

 

Cheri

Well here’s my problem is that I have such a drive to out-give. Like I want to be. And it looks generous. It looks like it’s humble even, like, I’m just going to be nothing but giving, giving, giving. I just, I always want to be one-up. I never want to be beholden to anyone. I don’t know where the word beholden came from, but it’s the word in my head. Be beholden to none. And the only way to never be beholden is to always have outgiven, and of course, you know with the A++ mentality, I can’t be just one-up I need to be ten-up, because if I’m ten-up then I will always stick. What is this mentality? I’m explaining it to you, and you are looking at me like it’s very sad, because it is.

 

Amy

No, I’m looking at you like, oh, I get that.

 

Cheri

Okay, now for the fun part of the show let’s take an assessment and see how we did. This seems to be my latest thing. Here’s the great news. I did my assignment. My results stink, okay?

 

Amy

Whew! Oh, okay, so let me ask you some questions about your results.

 

Cheri

Exactly. I will lie down on the couch and you can be Dr. Freud. How’s that? I’m about to come out not looking good at all.

 

Amy

Well, Cheri, do tell us about your hired-hand assessment.

 

Cheri

Thank you so much. I would love to Amy. Alright, so in going through, in checking the things that I struggle with on the hired-help mentality assessment. The ones that I checked that I was like, “Zing” were typically yes equals loved and no equals unloved. So, in other words, if somebody says yes to me they love me and if the say no they don’t love me. Or I feel loved or unloved, and I was like wow. Then, when I succeed I have difficulty celebrating the achievement quickly looking to what is next. I put a star by that one. And I resent God’s boundaries for me, and sometimes rebel against them. And, I put a check mark by that one.

 

Amy

Oh! Yes. I understand. Oh wait, no let me rise above this. Oh, Cheri that’s too bad.

 

Cheri

But hang on a second, okay, so those are the ones I struggle with the hired-help mentality. So, I thought, well, maybe I’ll do better on the beloved-daughter mentality assessment, so, the ones that I couldn’t check on this one. See if you sense a theme, Amy. See if you sense a theme. I could not honestly check I believe that God’s yes’s and no’s are for my good. Now, I would check that if he would just explain them. Let’s be clear. I would believe them if he would explain them and make it crystal clear, but I have trouble believing if I don’t know why. Give me the why.

 

Amy

Yes.

 

Cheri

The next one: I extend grace to others, because I’ve been shown so much grace by God. I do believe I’ve been shown grace by God. That part about extending it to others we are just going to skip that completely. Next one I didn’t check. I’m free to celebrate the success of others, because they are not a threat to my position in Christ, nor is my position in Christ a threat to theirs. And then, I did not check I trust God’s boundaries for me as safeguards and try to stay within them. So, I’m sensing a theme on both of them, and I didn’t do it intentionally, but I seem to struggle with celebrating with yes’s and no’s and with boundaries.

 

Amy

Those are hard issues, and I’m just looking. These have been sitting on my desk for a long time by the way. So, I have looked through them. But I was like how does she get in our head? And then I’m like, oh, we’re not alone. So, two things Cheri, obviously you’re not alone in these things, right? And P.S., as your friend and someone who has walked alongside you, I see enormous growth in these areas, these very areas. So, they might be your issues, but I mean, amazing growth like you’re learning and growing. So, receive that, yes.

 

Cheri

Thank you. Okay, so, I need to do what you say, I need to rub that into my heart. I’m going to do an Amy.

 

Amy

Yea. Rub it in.

 

Cheri

I’m going to rub it in. I’m going to rub it in, but you know Katie also said, that these actually aren’t assessments, they’re not judgements. There just an opportunity to see where we’re at, and so for all my whining and moaning here, I have to admit when I came up with similar results on each one I was like, oh, okay, I could feel terrible about it. And that’s probably what I would have done five years ago, six years ago; the perfectionism in me would have beaten me up. Or I can choose to say, wow, I have a crystal clear short list of things to take to the Holy Spirit now and to kind of make these themes as I’m reading scripture. As I’m reading through, I just finished reading through John, and I think I’m going to go through Luke next. And I’m going to be very carefully looking for anything and listening for anything God might be saying to me about celebration, about yes and no and about boundaries. Yeah, those.

 

Amy

That is such a great application, so for the rest of us, when we do our assessments from Katie’s awesome book, including me. We are going to look for these things and then use them as tools for better growth, more growth and, how do we say, our bibles. That’s such a great application, Cheri. It really is.

 

Cheri

Well the other thing that I loved is she said rest is not a punishment inflicted upon me, which made me think of the whole story I started with about not napping in preschool.

 

Amy

That is so awesome. Three-year-old Cheri.

 

Cheri

I will not nap. You can’t make me, but we need rest. So, what are you learning about rest?

 

Amy

I think the big thing for me is that rest for me has to be intentionally planned and preserved, because life is just, it is so full and it’s so rich. And I use the word busy and full and rich, you know, ‘cause we are all busy. Oh, gracious, we are all so busy. But what I’m realizing is, and so I tend to overwork these days cause I love what I’m doing, but overwork is still not good for me. No matter if I love it or not. We all need times that we’re unplugged, that we’re just resting that we’re having some fun for heaven’s sakes. And I’m just realizing it doesn’t just happen anymore. And I haven’t been good about planning those times of rest. We’ve talked a lot with Kathi Lipp, with Glynnis Whitwer about Sabbath. I’m doing a little better at that, but I think even just planning some fun is becoming important in my life. My husband tends to overwork, too, so, it’s not, you know, the two of us. There’s not a balance, and so I’m realizing this has to be intentional.

 

 

Cheri

Well, I was with you on the planning, and then you had to add preserving, ‘cause I plan it, and then I take it off my schedule. I schedule it and then something, some project laps over, and I’m like, I’ll just kick off the rest. Who needs that? So, I am now feeling convicted that I need the rest.

 

Amy

Well, I need to write those words on my desk someplace. Plan and preserve rest. Yes. I really, really loved talking to Katie, because I’ve done quite a bit of teaching on Martha, too. I think it’s because I am made like Martha. And so, I just get tired of hearing women’s ministry leaders and writers piling on Martha for heaven’s sake.

 

Cheri

Poor Martha. All we hear is “Martha Martha…”

 

Amy

Thank goodness for Katie who also came up with a redemptive perspective on Martha. I actually do a retreat where I lead people into all three scenes where Mary and Martha are. Yes, Martha missed it in that Martha and Mary scene. But in the second scene it’s actually Martha who goes straight to Jesus, and Mary stays back, and so I, but nobody ever talks about that scene. Hello! So, for those of you that feel like you’re made like Martha and you love Martha, just remember, hey, second chances are the sweetest. They are just the sweetest. And Martha gets a second chance, and she rises up and does it right. And that’s where, well even today, I need to park in that a little bit. Thankful for second chances!

 

My favorite name for God is Redeemer. I mean this is what he does the best. This is where he shows himself at his most merciful and graceful. And he does that for Martha, and he’ll do it for us.

 

Cheri

I’ve been so excited about recording this episode, because I wanted to share something my brother wrote and shared at my mother’s memorial service. My mother was a diehard Martha. I mean she really never liked that story of Mary and Martha. Her favorite phrase was, “If everybody sits and listens, who will get the work done?” That was always her question. And so, the little piece that I’m about to read you, I just want to leave a caveat that it’s a piece of creative writing, it’s not a piece of theology. But this is something my brother wrote in honor of our mother. And he used it to close the time that he and I spent sharing some of our memories of our mother.

 

It’s called “The Gospel According to Martha.”

“As Jesus and His disciples were on their way he came to a village where a woman named Eleanor opened her home to him. (My mother’s name was Eleanor.)

She had a sister called Mary who sat at the Lord’s feet listening to what He said.

But Eleanor was joyfully preparing the Lord’s favorite foods. Mary asked, “Lord, don’t you care that my sister is not here giving you her loving attention. Tell her to come here and sit down.”

“Mary, Mary,” the Lord answered, “You are sitting at my feet, but your mind is judging your sister.” Eleanor is loving me with her wholehearted preparation of food. She has chosen what is better, and it will not be taken away from her.

Mary wept and began to wet his feet with her tears then she wiped them with her hair, kissed them, and poured perfume on them.

The Lord said, you are worried and upset about many things, but only one thing is needed to love me in your own way.”

 

And it was just a different take; it didn’t really happen that way. Jesus didn’t really say those things. I want to be clear. I’m not trying to alter scripture.

 

Amy

Yes.

 

Cheri

But it was another way of realizing that God has created us each differently, and one of the things that Katie said is that He isn’t trying to change our personality. He’s not trying to change how we are wired that we are made like Martha and that’s a good thing.

 

Amy

So, so beautiful! And it really aligns theologically with that last scene where Mary anoints him, but Martha it says was serving, and this time, Martha was using her gift with the right attitude and there was no rebuke. There was no scene made, but she was still doing the same things that she had been doing in the first scene.

 

Cheri

Yes.

 

Amy

Which I love!

 

Cheri

Alright, so what’s the scripture that you’ve tied in with our interview with Katie?

 

Amy

The scripture I chose this week is Colossians 3:23, “Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for human masters.” And you know, when I looked at this scripture this time, ‘cause it’s kind of a familiar scripture. It’s thrown at us quite a bit, but I thought that little place in between the commas, “as working for the Lord,” is so important, because when we work for the Lord, we do it with the right motivation, with the right heart. When we working for the Lord it includes rest, because he gave us the Sabbath. And so, “as working for the Lord” is kind of where I want to focus this week. Is that we’re given work to do and when we do it for him it is glorious that we can celebrate being made like Martha.

 

Cheri

I love it. So, what is the bad rule that we’re breaking in these two episodes?

 

Amy

Martha and I have a fatal flaw.

 

I think we’ve really bought into that. Like, we’ve seen Martha like eww she has this fatal flaw, we don’t want to be like “Martha Martha…” Well, gosh, there are lots of flawed people in scripture that are given second chances. Hello, it’s time for Martha to get her second chance.

 

Cheri

Woo! I love it! So, what is the truth? What’s the fact we can focus on instead?

 

Amy

Like Martha, I’m created with the gift of loving my work.

 

Cheri

I love it. Okay, I’m going to rub that one in. This is an episode where I just get to rub truth in.

 

Amy

Do it. Take a moment. So, what’s the grit in this, all this, for you?

 

Cheri

Oh, I can tell you what the grit is. The grit is not judging others who aren’t made like Martha. I mean I talk to Martha’s all the time, and their number one struggle is they do the work and other people aren’t working quite as hard. They love their work. They’re serving God. They’re loving people. But oh, they want to judge, or it just rises up to judge people who aren’t getting things done. And so, I think the grit here is, ‘cause we don’t need the grit to do the work, that comes naturally.

 

Amy

Right.

 

Cheri

We love to do the work. What we need the grit for here is to stay in our lane, keep focusing to work for the Lord and not be checking out what everybody else is or isn’t doing. Whether they are doing as much as we are, the way that we are, and whether they are appreciating us. We don’t need recognition, but I think Martha’s really do like appreciation, and often don’t get it. So, I think not judging and not resenting the lack of appreciation at least for me those both take grit.

 

Amy

Oh, that resonates with me, too. I feel like as far as the grace part that every gift has an upside and a downside. And the grace for me is not focusing on the down side of loving our work, ‘cause I can get there really, really fast. So, we need to extend Martha some grace, and we need to extend ourselves some grace, as we work through the downsides of our gift.

 

Cheri

Head over to gritngracegirls.com/episode110.

 

Amy

That’s where you’ll find this week’s transcript, our digging deeper download, the Bible verse art, and you’ll have a chance to enter a giveaway for Made Like Martha.

 

Cheri

Come join our Facebook page and our Facebook group where we’ll continue this discussion of being made like Martha.

 

Amy

Next week we’ll be talking to Maria Furlough, so don’t miss that. She’s the author of Breaking the Fear Cycle.

 

Cheri

For today, grow your grit, embrace God’s grace, and when you run across a bad rule, you know what to do. Go right on ahead and…

 

Amy & Cheri

Break it.

 

Outtakes

 

Amy

Okay, so hopefully you can edit this out, because all of a sudden I’m like breaking into a cold sweat. I’m like, oh my gosh, I’m unreliable again. This is on my to-do list, but both of my boys are home, and I didn’t do it. Now, I know you are not editing that out. I am sweating. Oh my gosh. Okay.

 

<Laughter>

 

Cheri

I love this so much. Okay, so can you even find it on your computer, or do I need to read you the questions, Amy?

 

Amy

I have your photos on my computer.

 

Cheri

Oh, okay. Well, that’s good. But those are only part of the quiz. I only sent you little snippets of the quiz. Okay, for our listeners, Amy has now fallen on the floor.

 

Amy

My head is on the desk.

 

Cheri

Okay, so.

 

Amy

My deodorant has failed.

 

<Laughter>

 

Cheri

Amy, that possibly could be TMI, but, hey, it’s all good.

 

Okay, so I’m going to be the A student who presents her project to the class. Clearly your thumb drive is back at home. You don’t get to present today, Amy.

 

<Laughter>

 

Amy

This is terrible for my self-esteem, but makes a great episode. Awesome.

 

Cheri

Okay, and I don’t have Kleenex handy, and I’m crying. I’m laughing so hard. But of course, here is the great news. I did my assignment, my results stink, okay?

 

Amy

Okay, so let me ask you some questions about your results …

 

Take-Away for Today:

When Jesus said “Martha Martha” he spoke from a heart of love.